NOROC: Strategic Session on the "Way Forward": 2017-01-14

[offroadbiker]

So............... I have been fairly quit on this topic, but reading all the inputs with great interest. I only joined the Nissan club as it was a prerequisite for the Bridgestone club event that was held at Bass lake- many moons ago, after that well I was not really interested in joining the club.

Everything I have learned and required regarding my current vehicle was obtained from the forum, since I joined about 4 years ago the forum has grown and "trips" has slowly increased to such an extent that it is no longer possible to even attend all the outings. And yet we are looking at increasing/diversifying the outings arranged by the forum with the input from members.

We do not discriminate against any other brand should they wish to attend our outings, (ok so we do put a patrol forum sticker on their vehicle's ), I am not aware of a single incident on a forum outing where anybody misbehaved or did not act in a reasonably acceptable manner. ANY newby was assisted, showed the ropes, guided etc.

We do not have "pep" talks we do not sign documents at every single outing, we do not pressure anybody to do an obstacle if they don't want to, and we always get every single vehicle and participant safely to the end, and have a good -kuier- afterwards.

And these reasons I feel are greatly responsible for why the forum and its outings are such a huge success, we are there to enjoy nature and our vehicles, get away from the daily routine and the stress that goes with modern day living. I don't want to be treated like a child.......

I read that they way we as Nissan drivers behave are due to the "rules" from the Nissan club, yet should you join a forum outing these days, the majority of the guys attending was never part of the Nissan club has never been told how to behave and conduct themselves and yet they indirectly just do......... just and observation.............

Does the fact that the NISSAN name gets affiliated with NOROC lead to all the admin, rules, health and safety?????????? then I would rather go with the forum where liability rests with the individual ME - MYSELF and I.

Is it my responsibility as a Nissan owner to give media coverage and advertising to NISSAN? What gives them any right to prescribe to me on how I spend my free time and money?? Why should they have any say on the way we run the forum or for that matter the club? Am I against the club? - NO, do I see any benefit to belonging to the club? NO!

So what is my reason for attending tomorrow's meeting you ask then. I am not going to try and convince Nissan to be a part of the forum and for that matter a part of the club. I am going there to have them convince me why they should be a part of us!!!!!!!!

Secondly I am not going there to join NOROC, because as stated the current way things are done does not fall within the parameters on how I am conducting my 4x4 excursions, BUT I am willing to listen to what they have to say on how they are planning to turn things around, if they are willing to listen I will give my input take it don't take it. Convince me and I might be willing to assist.

As have been mentioned in this thread - why fix what is not broken - the Patrol Forum is not broken, does not need fixing, and definitely does not need ANYBODY wanting to come and pre-scribe to the forum on how we must do things.

Have I stepped on some toes - I am sure that I have. Am I going to apologize - No. If NOROC wants to change then they will have to make some hard decisions, face the fact that the club will not survive the next 2 years at the current rate. I don't have all the answers, hell I might not have a single answer, but the beauty of this forum I have an opinion and we can all agree to disagree, and none of the active forum members will have an ego melt down about this.

There ya go - my little input on the matter, lets converse on the matter tomorrow

[offroadbiker]

On another point.

Due to this meeting being scheduled we have kept back the "draft" year plan for the Patrol forum, however we feel it might be of interest to NOROC and even maybe Nissan to see what we have planned as a forum for 2017.

Also we need some input from forum members on what they would like to do this year.

I have noticed the tendency that their is a need for outings to include the whole family and not just the "old boys club" so please tell us, and we will aim to please As example we did Buffalo Gorge where we did not only drive the 4x4 route but also did some horse ride's and abseiling, an outing that is still discussed on current outings - so I am sure there is a need for this.

I am attaching the Draft plans as well as a questionnaire - please complete and give as much input as possible its the only way we can ensure that we get everybody involved and take the forum even further

[David M]

The forums trips and outings have grown since I started attending 3 years ago and continue to grow to the point where most people would not be able to attend all the outings. Most formal clubs would look on in envy at what has happened. Participants have included vehicles from other brands yet I have yet to see a Nissan other than a Patrol on a trip/outing. I would say that from about 4 years ago the numbers would have been totally the opposite way around, but as time went on, many owners sold their trusy steeds and bought the best steed..... A Patrol, hence the numbers swapping

I think a large part of the reason for the success and growth of the forum has been the fact that it is not an official club beholden to a committee, rules, code of conduct or vehicle manufacturer. Yet everyone pitches in, there have been no incidents (well maybe the Limo but the only casualty was a Tilapia) and there is almost an unspoken code of conduct. ( I believe that the unspoken rules that happen withing the Patrol forum outings are a continuation from what guys have adapted to from the NORC. For example, the no drinking while driving. a few years back there were guys that would have a beer or a drink of some sorts on a trail..... and luckily for us we never had an incident - but NEVER say it cannot happen to me - and thats why you see so many dumbass youtube videos of drivers making the 4x4 industry look like a bunch of ******. This should even apply to passengers as I don't as a sober driver want to ride over someone that stumbles into my path. Please not that I am mearly saying that rules are a GOOD thing, and the Patrol and NORC guys do hopefully without being asked, follow these basic rules. Us as owners/drivers also understand that the way in which things are done can be toned down a bit, as we all probably did our time in the SANDF and also need to receive the respect that we deserve as *experienced* drivers. so rules and code of conduct work hand in hand.... if everyone sticks to the rules ( written or unwritten ) then the code of conduct will fall automatically have a fantastic outcome. So what I'm saying in a nutshell is that I believe that the way the Patrol forum conducts things from how egos an everything is concerned, is due to NORC's setting up of the rules. Look at how many outsiders have said that the Nissan guys are the most amazing guys, with great ethics !!!!

By definition a Patrol owner is an individual and I fear that formalising things may detract from what has made it so successful. (I don't believe that NORC will formalize anything. I am very much a non conformist and don't really do the club / group thing too well, as I want to do what I want, when I want. As I mentioned many pages back, I have a soft spot for NORC, as I learnt a lot..... and I mean a LOT from the knowledge that was on offer to me. I enjoyed the camaraderie that NORC had, and still has. I think the members outgrew what NORC was offering, as we weren't getting the new members into NORC as we would have liked. hence tthe reason why the outlook and focus of NORC, in my opinion needs to evolve with the members, yet still be able to offer the newcomer/new owner the opportunity to learn from a responsible bunch of fantastic people.

Therefore my only wish is that NOROC and the forum be kept separate. That way people have the option of both, one or neither. Intertwining the two would however be a recipe for neither to grow. NORC members have been piggybacking on the Patrol forum for many many years, so I have to disagree with you there. I'm guessing ( if you look back in the Patrol Archives ) that the Patrol outings was basically indirectly started by NORC guys on the forum, saying " hey lets get together at this place " due to the piggy backing on the Patrol Forum.

David, I was just commenting on what you were saying to "play devils advocate" from another perspective, and I know you know its not directed at you or anyone, purely to throw different perspectives out there....

Firstly you can add my name to the list of attendees tomorrow.

Thank you for the background. It puts more perspective on things for me who was not around in the NORC days and I appreciate the comments and dialogue.

I think this open debate is healthy and can only result in the best outcome for everyone. I wish more would enter into it.

As you say NORC evolved into what currently exists and I have not seen a single comment saying that what currently exists is better or worse than NORC and I am not qualified to comment. The ideal would like to see NORC strong again and nothing changing with the forum. Dilution is the risk being taken here and how to ensure that everything comes out stronger is the challenge.

"NORC members have been piggybacking on the Patrol forum for many many years, so I have to disagree with you there. I'm guessing ( if you look back in the Patrol Archives ) that the Patrol outings was basically indirectly started by NORC guys on the forum, saying " hey lets get together at this place " due to the piggy backing on the Patrol Forum." _ My question is why would they start informal gatherings outside the auspices of NORC rather than have them as club events?

With regards to the rules and code of conduct I would like to believe it is more about who the people are than anything that is or has been enforced. I however still have my concerns about this as a couple of things that have taken place on Patrol outings could definetly not be condoned by an official club yet there was no risk to anything or anyone and if anything had gone wrong the only explanation would have been to the insurance company.

If I can see benefit to our community as a whole I will be the first one to put my name on the membership form and pay tomorrow even if I never attend an event I am showing my support, My attitude has been the same as PC so far (I think pg2) that if I can not contribute I should not belong but that has changed to where I would rather show my support for others even if I am not able to attend/contribute.

"David, I was just commenting on what you were saying to "play devils advocate" from another perspective, and I know you know its not directed at you or anyone, purely to throw different perspectives out there..." - Keep it coming dude - I can not see any disadvantages to healthy debate and perspectives. I hope some of the people that I have spoken to telephonically start weighing in.

A new point - George says that the senior marketing manager from Nissan will be there and some representatives from Atlantis Nissan. I would have hoped for some more Dealers and hope that the "guy with the ponytail" is not there as purely a marketing exercise but can give positive input and make decisions.

[ricster]

Thank you Dirk !!... You have made VERY valid points!!! Do you need to apologies, hell no !! These things need to be said tomorrow so as to clear the air!!

Alex, also very valid points.

I hope tomorrow will be a VERY successful get together for how the Nissan club can grow and evolve into the family fun filled club that it used to be years back and that the Patrol forum currently is.

[Alex Roux]

I would have hoped for some more Dealers and hope that the "guy with the ponytail" is not there as purely a marketing exercise but can give positive input and make decisions.

Thats not ChristosSlang?!
Any other guys with ponytails from NORC or this forum?

Christo, I hope you are coming. Just don't pretend to David that you are the marketing guy!!!

[offroadbiker]

Oelie Plus 1 will also be joining.

[David M]

Thank you Dirk and Alex for weighing in while I was typing. Now we are getting somewhere. More input from others will result in the best decisions being made tomorrow.

[georgeb]

Good afternoon all

MW Nissan Fourways will be represented as well.

[Jorrie]

Thank you to all the participants today. The discussion was robust and healthy. Now for Nissan to come to the party and we will do our bit.

[Herrie]

Ek is baie bly dat julle by ons vergadering was!