4.5 Clutch

Transmissions, Transfer Boxes, Axles, Drive Shafts
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by Peter Connan »

iandvl wrote: 25 Feb 2022 09:01 A final post on this matter - with some photographs.

I just felt I had to make the post, as the amount of foresight and care that was involved in the design of the Y61 (and presumably the other variants as well - but I don't know them as I know my Y61) never ceases to amaze me.
...
And, as I mentioned earlier, the design decisions made during the design of the motor and relevant peripherals is absolutely astounding.
Jip, somebody thought about that for quite a while. You have a "life extension service" for the locker and the clutch, as those should work at least for at least a short while after engine turn-off, but not for the brakes which would normally not be used with the engine off(unless the vehicle is being towed, in which case you need more than a little tank like these would give) but where reliability is important (thus you want the minimum complexity and certainly not a little plastic tank which can be easily damaged).

Thanks Ian.
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by Spike »

It's possible to weld that plastic. You use a soldering iron with a kinda stitching motion and add plastic here n there as needed using a bit of cable tie as a welding rod. There is a bit of technique involved but easy to get the hang of it. I learned via a YT video
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by Tinus lotz »

Great Post man thanks for the info. also if your motor is running your
breaks wil work better than I have a leak and now my breaks don't work scenario. vacuum can be a bitch to sort great one man
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by SJC »

:goodpost: thanks for the info... :salute:

Eish this wekeend I need to go and have a look at some of the things mentioned here in this thread...

Started noticing the clutch feeling a bit stiff at times.... more noticeable when engine refs are higher :think:
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by SJC »

Spike wrote: 24 Feb 2022 08:59 Quite likely the diaphragm spring on the pressure plate that has collapsed. That's been the cause of stiff clutch pedal for me in the past
Did this cause a consistent stiff clutch or periodically stiff?
(Trying to determine the cause of my clutch being stiff sometimes...)

Is there a way to test a clutch booster?
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by Peter Connan »

The most likely thing that can cause the clutch to be stiff sometimes and not others is a problem with the vacuum system.

Probably not the booster itself, but the vacuum supply.

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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by SJC »

iandvl wrote: 25 Feb 2022 09:01 A final post on this matter - with some photographs.

I just felt I had to make the post, as the amount of foresight and care that was involved in the design of the Y61 (and presumably the other variants as well - but I don't know them as I know my Y61) never ceases to amaze me.

The vacuum system on the Patrol comprises of (in my case) two pods / canisters just in front of the difflock solenoid close to the firewall on the passenger side of the engine bay. The vacuum is created by a steel pipe from the intake manifold, and all rubber hoses have non-return valves in place. The pods are there to maintain vacuum so that it should still be possible to press the clutch and brakes relatively easily even when the vehicle is off. As with all things vacuum, I don't think it is always perfect - should the vehicle be off for a while, I'm sure the vacuum will leak and this will result in the clutch being harder to press if the vehicle has been off for a while. When starting the vehicle though, the vacuum will build up again and the clutch will be softer thereafter. I read many reports of this from our Boggan friends in Oz yesterday whilst reading up on my possible issues. I can also remember experiencing the same thing on the one or two occasions when my truck has been standing for a bit. One can literally feel the clutch get softer as one starts the vehicle.

In any case, the one pipe on the left-hand pod was broken off. There was an indication that it must have been repaired quite recently, based on the glue at the base. As I mentioned before, I'm not going to dwell on that.

I stuck the pipe back on using super glue after which I gave it a liberal dose of epoxy. This has worked - the clutch is fine again now. Anthony has a spare vacuum pod for me, and I'll collect it at some point and install it.

I think the only thing I'm confused about is that although my clutch was very stiff, the brakes were totally unaffected. And yet the various diagrams I've seen on the TB45 motor indicates that the brake booster should run off the same pod as the clutch. This makes no sense, so I'm going to have to see exactly where the brake booster vacuum pipe is connected. Perhaps it runs from the other pod ? I shall investigate this at some point in time.

This is a photograph of the broken pod.

Broken-1.jpg

And this photograph should illustrate the non-return valves on the rubber pipes. The yellow arrows on the pipe indicate which way around the pipes should be and there is also a visible thickening of the pipe at these locations. These thicker bits are the non-return valves. If you remove the pipe and blow through it, you will only be able to blow through it in one direction. One can also note the liberal amount of epoxy around the broken pod in the background of this photo... :rolling: :rolling:

Non-Return.jpg

In any case, I'm happy it was not a collapsed diaphragm. And I learnt something new yesterday too. And, as I mentioned earlier, the design decisions made during the design of the motor and relevant peripherals is absolutely astounding.
For reverence, the GQ’s setup seems to be different than the GU’s.

None of these “pods” are present. From manifold: pipe run to a t-piece, where it split to brake booster and clutch booster respectively...
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by mvcoller »

HA!!!

So now I know why my TD30 clutch pedal is so hard, until I start it......

Got some inspection to do. Where does the clutch vacuum pipe run to, the clutch slave cylinder or the clutch master cylinder? I will trace it from that end.
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Re: 4.5 Clutch

Post by Peter Connan »

Malcolm, I don't know the 3l cars well.

On the TB and TD-engined cars, there is a small clutch booster between the firewall and the master cylinder.

It looks (and works) exactly like a miniaturized brake booster.
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